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by **Dango** on Sat Dec 17, 2005 8:54 am

My 87 van runs great when warm but it takes me several tries to get it running when it's cold. It sometimes starts and runs for a few seconds then suddenly dies like it starved for fuel. It's been like this for some time now and I've found a way to get it going without too much trouble (pressing the gas peddle down about 1/2 inch and keeping it there while turning it over seems to work to get it started and I have to keep the revs up until it's semi warm) Afer that, I'm ok!
I think it must be a sensor problem but I've not been able to fix it yet. I'm thinking of taking it to a shop where they could plug it into a computer and tell me which sensor(s) are bad and I could change it myself.
Has anyone else had that kind of problem? Is it a good idea to take it to a shop or would it be a waste of time?? Should I bite the bullet and take it to a Toyota shop??? or does anyone here have any ideas I should try first???
BTW the check engine light has been on through this and the codes are 4 and 11.

by **kcg795** on Sat Dec 17, 2005 9:01 am

Either one of the sensors around your radiator cap has gone bad or disconnected. One of the sensors is a cold start time switch. If it fails in some way, your cold start injector won't operate. Your cold start injector could've failed too, but I don't think that can trip a check engine light. I noticed on my van, it won't run with one of the sensors around the radiator cap disconnected. When it is disconnected, it also trips the check engine light and the engine will sputter for a bit and stall.

by **Dango** on Sat Dec 17, 2005 5:03 pm

Thanks kcg795, I already tried that...I took it off (the sensor), tried the one from my other van, no luck! Also tried one from a van at the wreckers with no change. Maybe it's the wiring harness or the wires going to that sensor.
Like I said, I've had this problem for some time now...I've also replaced the fuel filter and tried another throttle position sensor.
I also removed my cold start injector, cleaned and tested it. It works fine.
I'm running out of ideas, that's why I was starting to think about bringing it to a shop...what do you think?

by **timsrv** on Sat Dec 17, 2005 8:37 pm

I'm not sure which sensor you're talking about (maybe the same one), but I'd check your "Cold Start Injector Time Switch". Unplug the brown plastic connector & use an ohmmeter to measure resistance as shown below. If resistance is not within specs, then replace it. BTW, there is no code #4 or #11. Codes start on #12, skip around a bit, then end on #71. I'm thinking you might be interpreting Code #22 as #4. Code #22 is (2) .5 second blinks with a 1.5 second space between them. That's the code for water temp sensor problems. The water temp sensor is located on the opposite side of the filler port housing (green plastic connector). There should be a resistance of 200 ohms to 40k ohms between the 2 terminals depending on coolant temp. Tim

by **Wonderwagon** on Sat Dec 17, 2005 9:29 pm

I'm not sure which one you show the spec's for Tim, but I know at least the '89 models have a different CSI Time Switch than other years.

by **Dango** on Sun Dec 18, 2005 12:41 am

Thanks Tim, I'll do just that. I just recently bought a decent multimeter, I'll let you know how it works out.
I looked at the "on line manual" at yotavan.org and found a more complete list of codes there.
Code 4 says "water temp sensor , circuit or ecu"
Code 11 says "Air conditioning switch,throttle position sensor or circuit, neutral start switch or ecu."
I know what you mean though, I have a chilton manual at home and the codes in there start at 12...don't know why.
I have to work one more shift then I'm off for 12 so I should have time to play in between Christmas festivities.
I sure like it when you and others include pictures and diagrams to illustrate what you are saying! Thanks for that!
I'll have to figure out how to do that some day!

Later

by **Bill Maley** on Sun Dec 18, 2005 3:00 am

The wiring in the csi time switch's connector may be broken from being smooshed by the power steering pump hose. Had that happen in my first van, had to splice in a new connector.

by **timsrv** on Sun Dec 18, 2005 4:00 am

Wonderwagon wrote:I'm not sure which one you show the spec's for Tim, but I know at least the '89 models have a different CSI Time Switch than other years.

Forgot to mention these spec's are from my 89 service manual. Good point WW about spec's being different for different years. This could also explain the discrepency of the trouble codes not matching either. Of course it's always best to look up information specific to the year & model of vehicle being serviced. Tim

by **Dango** on Sun Dec 18, 2005 10:43 pm

Tim, can I assume that the temps mentioned in the diagram are the coolant temps?
I guess I'll have to buy myself a thermometer...I hear Safeway has cheap ones that work good for that.

by **timsrv** on Sun Dec 18, 2005 11:02 pm

Yes, coolant temp. To check this remove the radiator fill cap & place the thermometer in the coolant. Caution: only remove this cap when engine is cold. It's a good idea to squeeze the radiator hose before opening to verify its soft & squishy. If it's hard, use extreme caution as your system might be pressurized. Digital meat thermometers fall in the desired range for most automotive work (including this). Any time you use an unfamiliar thermometer, it's a good idea to check it for accuracy. To check the low end, place it in a cup of ice water, wait for things to equalize, and check temp (should read 0 deg C or 32 deg F). For checking the high end, place the probe in boiling water and check it again (should read 100 deg C or 212 deg F). If it's off a bit that's okay, just make a mental note so you can compensate accordingly while using it. I think you can find a nice digital one at most supermarkets for under $15. Tim

Danger: never put a mercury type thermometer in boiling water unless the temp range exceeds 212 deg F.

by **Dango** on Fri Dec 23, 2005 4:43 am

Well I bought myself a termometer at Safeway for $5.00, works good. Did the test per the chart for the 87 van and it's showing the right ohms at the right temps. I guess the sensor is good...so it's probably the wiring harness or the ECU. I checked the harness for any obvious damage and found nothing so far. I'm going to have to put this task on the back burner for now. I have the other van to fix first (overtemp).
Thanks for all the help guys!
Much appreciated!

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